×

Loading...
Ad by
  • 最优利率和cashback可以申请特批,好信用好收入offer更好。请点链接扫码加微信咨询,Scotiabank -- Nick Zhang 6478812600。
Ad by
  • 最优利率和cashback可以申请特批,好信用好收入offer更好。请点链接扫码加微信咨询,Scotiabank -- Nick Zhang 6478812600。

Why Chinese immigrants struggle with English fluency?

本文发表在 rolia.net 枫下论坛---Toronto Star, Published on Sunday June 03, 2012

Zhenyong Li has no trouble speaking English in his engineering jargon, but the Chinese immigrant says it can still be challenging to carry on small talk.

And yet, casual conversation with native speakers around the water cooler is crucial to language development — and social integration — for those whose mother tongue is something else, especially Mandarin.

A new study found the Mandarin-speaking immigrants it tracked had made “no significant progress” in their English accent, fluency and comprehensibility seven years after their arrival here, compared with their Slavic-language (Russian and Ukrainian) speaking counterparts.

The study by the Montreal-based Institute for Research on Public Policy followed 25 immigrants each from Mandarin and Slavic groups, and assessed their listening and speaking skills at years 1, 2 and 7.

“Mandarin-speakers over time did not get much easier to understand when native listeners heard them speak,” said University of Alberta educational psychology professor Tracey Derwing, who co-authored the study with NorQuest College language instructor Erin Waugh.

“They made very little progress in their pronunciation and fluency. They still had many pauses and hesitation.”

Participants in the study — all possessing the same overall language proficiency, well-educated and with similar language training here — were shown pictures and asked to describe them in their own words, while being evaluated by 30 listeners to eliminate any bias or subjectivity.

Researchers also found the Mandarin speakers had had significantly fewer conversations of 10 minutes or more with native and non-native English speakers than did the Slavic participants.

The Mandarin speakers were, as a whole, more reluctant to initiate conversation and appeared to be less aware of current local events than the Slavic speakers.

The Slavic speakers, as a group, the report said, were more assertive and more deliberate in their effort to learn English. They also had an advantage because of interests shared with the larger community (ice hockey, for example), which helped with conversations.

Li, who came here from Shanghai in 1998, said Mainland Chinese learn their English from textbooks through reading and writing, and have no opportunity to drill their listening and speaking skills outside the classroom.

“If you cannot listen or speak proper English, you feel discouraged to participate in a conversation because you are afraid others don’t understand you,” said Li, 52, who has a master’s degree in engineering from the California Institute of Technology and is a manager of a Markham consulting firm.

The Chinese Professionals Association of Canada in Toronto has introduced several programs to address the language gap, which focus on pronunciation and “soft skills” in communication.

“It’s vital to be able to carry small talk,” said its president, Hugh Zhao, who moved here from Shenyang in 1989. “Small talk leads to common understanding and other big topics. It’s not enough just to talk about the weather in Canada.”

Zhao, a computing manager at the University of Toronto, said the Chinese language is very different from the English alphabet, and so are the cultures attached to those language.

Also, silence, which for the Chinese is a virtue reflecting humbleness, is not valued in the West, where people tend to appreciate participation and outspokenness.

“(Mainland) Chinese students are not active in class because, if they understand it, they don’t want to show off. And if they do not understand something, they don’t want to ask and show their ignorance,” Zhao said.

“Sometimes, people are just afraid to make mistakes and decide not to speak. We have to learn not to be afraid to embarrass and humiliate ourselves.”

Derwing said English-language training for immigrants must focus more on listening, speaking and pronunciation skills, as well as the so-called soft skill of engaging in casual conversation.

“Communication is a two-way street. The burden of communication should not be on immigrants’ shoulders only,” she added. “Canadians should not just zone out or shut down when they hear somebody speak with an accent.”更多精彩文章及讨论,请光临枫下论坛 rolia.net
Report

Replies, comments and Discussions:

  • 工作学习 / 外语学习 / Why Chinese immigrants struggle with English fluency?
    本文发表在 rolia.net 枫下论坛---Toronto Star, Published on Sunday June 03, 2012

    Zhenyong Li has no trouble speaking English in his engineering jargon, but the Chinese immigrant says it can still be challenging to carry on small talk.

    And yet, casual conversation with native speakers around the water cooler is crucial to language development — and social integration — for those whose mother tongue is something else, especially Mandarin.

    A new study found the Mandarin-speaking immigrants it tracked had made “no significant progress” in their English accent, fluency and comprehensibility seven years after their arrival here, compared with their Slavic-language (Russian and Ukrainian) speaking counterparts.

    The study by the Montreal-based Institute for Research on Public Policy followed 25 immigrants each from Mandarin and Slavic groups, and assessed their listening and speaking skills at years 1, 2 and 7.

    “Mandarin-speakers over time did not get much easier to understand when native listeners heard them speak,” said University of Alberta educational psychology professor Tracey Derwing, who co-authored the study with NorQuest College language instructor Erin Waugh.

    “They made very little progress in their pronunciation and fluency. They still had many pauses and hesitation.”

    Participants in the study — all possessing the same overall language proficiency, well-educated and with similar language training here — were shown pictures and asked to describe them in their own words, while being evaluated by 30 listeners to eliminate any bias or subjectivity.

    Researchers also found the Mandarin speakers had had significantly fewer conversations of 10 minutes or more with native and non-native English speakers than did the Slavic participants.

    The Mandarin speakers were, as a whole, more reluctant to initiate conversation and appeared to be less aware of current local events than the Slavic speakers.

    The Slavic speakers, as a group, the report said, were more assertive and more deliberate in their effort to learn English. They also had an advantage because of interests shared with the larger community (ice hockey, for example), which helped with conversations.

    Li, who came here from Shanghai in 1998, said Mainland Chinese learn their English from textbooks through reading and writing, and have no opportunity to drill their listening and speaking skills outside the classroom.

    “If you cannot listen or speak proper English, you feel discouraged to participate in a conversation because you are afraid others don’t understand you,” said Li, 52, who has a master’s degree in engineering from the California Institute of Technology and is a manager of a Markham consulting firm.

    The Chinese Professionals Association of Canada in Toronto has introduced several programs to address the language gap, which focus on pronunciation and “soft skills” in communication.

    “It’s vital to be able to carry small talk,” said its president, Hugh Zhao, who moved here from Shenyang in 1989. “Small talk leads to common understanding and other big topics. It’s not enough just to talk about the weather in Canada.”

    Zhao, a computing manager at the University of Toronto, said the Chinese language is very different from the English alphabet, and so are the cultures attached to those language.

    Also, silence, which for the Chinese is a virtue reflecting humbleness, is not valued in the West, where people tend to appreciate participation and outspokenness.

    “(Mainland) Chinese students are not active in class because, if they understand it, they don’t want to show off. And if they do not understand something, they don’t want to ask and show their ignorance,” Zhao said.

    “Sometimes, people are just afraid to make mistakes and decide not to speak. We have to learn not to be afraid to embarrass and humiliate ourselves.”

    Derwing said English-language training for immigrants must focus more on listening, speaking and pronunciation skills, as well as the so-called soft skill of engaging in casual conversation.

    “Communication is a two-way street. The burden of communication should not be on immigrants’ shoulders only,” she added. “Canadians should not just zone out or shut down when they hear somebody speak with an accent.”更多精彩文章及讨论,请光临枫下论坛 rolia.net
    • 嘿嘿。Wrong Sample Size。 应该把美帝苏修,漫步寻梅,小C,红大侠,qiaoqiao 放进去,这结果立马就不是打酱油了,那肯定是Daydayup,或者是心想事成。 :-)
      • 我在单位听过英语说得好的国移和印度东欧的同事相比还是稍差一些,更不能和那些canadian比了,国移们只能靠技术上压倒他们换取语言文化上的平等!
        • How sure you are?
          • 楼上的英语绝对比老东和老印好。
          • 多数国移英文欠佳是不争的事实。
            • 酱油有点儿鼠目寸光吧? 你看的只是一点, 你那一点, 永远不是全部. 比你英语好的其实大有人在, 肉联只少有一个埃里克. 天天看你评论别人的英语, 永远见不到你写一句或说一句英语.
              • 俗称,管中窥豹,一叶障目。
                • Yep. Top down rather than bottom up.
                  • me 2。我也喜欢先穿衣服后穿裤子。
                    • Winterstorm does better than that.
              • 你的神经是挺很敏感,说话也容易信口开河。在下偶尔评评而已,到你嘴里就是“天天”,本人不常写英文贴,到你嘴里就是“永远不写”。 不过也不难理解,这是尔等的通病。
                • Ha ha ha. Hooked. Show me your strength.
                  • 本人不习惯和老中们摆弄英文。
                    • You don't even know how to do instant writing I guess. And when you do so to your so called foreigners they may not understand you.
                      • Instant writing? Did you mean " write on an impulse?" 有instant messaging, 不代表就instant writing. 还有就是,主句和从句之间要用逗号分开。
                    • I feel a spontaneous self denial personality from you. poor guy.
                      • That's a proven reality.
                    • 正好酱油兄在这儿,我这儿有个小小的请求。
                      阁下不习惯跟老中摆弄英文,这个是你自己的选择,别人没权说三道四。

                      我现在这个谈话系列已经写了快60篇了,里面的观点不可能都正确。所以能否恳请酱油兄,刺哥,兵兄,还有以前的胡司令,如果认为我的文章里有诸如和实际不符的地方,言过其实的地方,应该强调却遗漏了的地方,还有其他各种误导的成分,请多提建设性意见。

                      谢谢。
                      • You are making a constructive effort. Regardless imperfections of your postings or whatever comments on your work you are helping Rolians or at least some Rolians in a positive way. That’s good enough to me.
                        • Regardless of something, regardless和of之间从来不夹东西。在这里用regardless也不太妥当,言下之意是你已经研究过,证实苏修之文有疏漏错误,你还"大人大量,视若不见"呢:)。 I dont think that is what you mean.
                          语言不仅仅讲究严谨,还讲究风度。你大凡可以这么表达:这么表达: "Although you might make some mistakes,..."

                          还有就是,从句与主句之间你不用逗号,这个习惯还是改了吧?
                          • 谢谢指教. 边看大选, 边学英语, 这好. 你这老师比酱油哥强. 曾是北大西语系英语教授吧?
                          • 应该是 you might have made some mistakes.
                            • 从时态角度来看,改得好,时间概念更精确了,值得参考.
                      • 美帝治学严谨,乐于助人,为人谦逊,是个可以与之讨论问题的好网友。几十篇文章费了不少辛劳,值得尊重。不过在下认为发音主要依赖模仿能力,先天的成分很大,那些发音理论方面的东西对中年国移有多少实际意义,在下不敢乐观。
                        • 酱油兄说得很对。其实不光你不乐观,我也不乐观。我写的东西,其实只对少数人有用。这些少数人能找到他们需要的信息,对我而言差不多也就足够了。另外把这几年的一些感想写下来放在这儿,也算是有个地方保存一下。
                          • 最好自己手上也有备份,这么长篇的作品万一丢了可惜。
                            • 言之有理。这就去备份。
                        • Practice makes perfect. Heater has set a good example. Upload yours, not PK but provide us some guidance.
                          • Provide somebody WITH something. 这个我发现用错频率特别高。
                            • 两者都没错, 一个口语化些, 一个虽然正式但咬文嚼字.
                              • 刺哥是煮熟的鸭子。
                                • 我的老板天天说 provide me an answer, provide me the number, 根本不说 provide me with something. 人家是土生土长的北美人, 哈佛高材生
                                  • 你见过人家的毕业证书么?
                                    • 挂在办公室的墙上. 要不让酱油哥去打打假?
                                      • 没PP没真相啊。你跟酱油哥打过架?
                                        • 我哪敢呢, 他一见我就穷追猛打吗.
                                          • 真的么?俺怎么没看见?酱油哥这两天好像脾气好多了。
                                            • 是不错. 我其实是逗他玩儿的, 知道他涵养好, 脾气好.
                                      • 哈佛毕业证书还要放办公室墙上:),trust me, this does not happen:-). 这就跟没见过什么叫money, 就看看可爱的好莱坞片,以为富人非得坐limousine才叫money,哈哈!
                                        • 哥, 你可能有点儿少见多怪. 这个很常见的.
                        • 发音我觉得三分靠先天(大多是听力的问题),七分还是靠勤练。
          • Do you mean 'How sure are you'?
            • 这种错误对他来说简直小得不值一提。
              • You know what you know only. You won't even know what you don’t understand now.
                • 4个词的句子摆不对顺序,贴一句话要改两遍,别逗我了好吗,我正在吃螃蟹啊。
                  • 不要侮辱我们刺哥,刺哥的英语那是这个坛子里数一数二的,他几乎从来不用中文,以至于我都怀疑他还会不会说中文。
                    • 刺头很有娱乐性。但本人强烈建议别在吃螃蟹或啃鸡爪时看他的言论,有呛着的危险。
                      • Shall I call 911 for you?
                      • What's your location?
                      • Are you still there? Eat less for dinner.
                        • 螃蟹安全啃完。
                          • How many?
                          • 打到政府工! 六点钟就吃完晚饭了, 还是螃蟹. 我们这些纳税人辛辛苦苦干, 这才刚刚到家. 太不公平了.
                            • 查查我今天第一个帖子是几点发的,你就知道我为什么6点就吃完饭了。
                              • 查个什么劲儿啊. 明明白白写着4:27 AM 吗. 这个说明不了问题. 如厕的空当就能发个贴, 这就像我 on the GO 的时候只能用没有中文输入的手机随时发帖一样.
                                • 你以为每个人都和你一样上网这么有瘾?如厕空档发帖,看到你的高论之后笑得睡不着了可不是闹着玩的。4点27分的时候,本人已经起床,在吃早饭了。那时你还在打呼噜吧?
                                  • 猫哥就是个好例子吗. 我的贡献还不够, 需要继续努力. 政府工需要起那么早吗? 要是TTC头班车司机还差不多.
                  • Can you put your words in your excellent English?
                  • Or in French if you prefer.
          • "How sure are you?" 别忘了倒置。
            • It is not uncommon to use "how sure you are" instead of "how sure are you" when emphasizing /implying that "you are actually not sure about it at all".
              • 刺兄,我说句不中听的话,英语学歪了,还有救;治学态度歪了,就麻烦了。 How sure you are 是可以说,但是只有放在重句里面,才由倒装变正装。这跟强调没关系。
                • 这话我爱听. 别客气.
        • 有点绝对哈。
          • 你也知道我们的语系和别人不同,需要更多努力!
            • 呵呵,我现在已经很少想语言了,想交流多了。
              • 现在说英语流利了,再提高就要在语言上再下功夫,如发音,意群,韵律。
                • 酱油哥会说 - 现在英语口语流利了, 再下去就是精益求精, 在发音,意群,韵律上下功夫.
                • 这些我也不看了。现在唯一的追求就是:达意。
                  • 达意和追求意群韵律什么的根本不矛盾哪,可以平行前进。当然你的意思可能是说,人的精力是有限的,没法兼顾。
                    • 小溪的英文口语会盖酱油哥一大帽儿. 他根本不是对手.
                    • 我经常整小时整小时的对话,对方听我讲话时,在意群韵律上,并不为难。所以我也不知道还要进步什么了。反倒是达意上面,我不够好。现在就都放在这上了。
                      • 这个容易,你来一段即兴谈话,录音发上来,兵哥刺哥大伙一听,就知道你可以在哪方面提高一下。题目可以选你最熟悉的话题。
                        • 美帝啊, 别支我的招儿呀. 今晚看美国大选, 有点嗨. 说胡话也是可能的.
                        • 我周围都是 AMERICAN 了,还要他们两个干嘛啊。现实是最好的检验,我生活,工作都没有阻滞,自己知道的。慢慢提高吧,每天都会有新发现。
                          • 小溪妹妹自己就是米国人吗.
                            • 咱都是一代移民,那有和老外真打实练来得快捷有效呢?你说呢?
                              • 发音语感, 是. 语法修辞用法, 不一定.
                                • 绝大可能你是对的。不过我现在脑子里转的都是达意的事儿。还没倒出空儿来想严谨的语法等事件。有时间的吧。估计那时早半拍儿的苏修的精品就派上用场了。
                                  • 哎,不对不对,替你瞎急一下啊:这个语法是间架结构,是胶水,要达意,很大程度上靠语法,是事半功倍的招;有词汇有发音,没语法,好好的高知青年,可惜了。
                                    • 我留意一下。我不觉我的语法弱。请老读者刺哥和兵哥指教。
                                      • My worst part actually. Will sidetrack you for sure.
                                        • one assumed supporter is out now.
                                          • Goingconcern is an expert in the English language.
                                            • Good for him.
                                              • good for her。goingconcern 是个大美女,歌唱的尤其好,而且还是大拿,文章也写的好。
                                                • Really, really, really? Where is the link?
                                                  • 两个点击就行了,你还费劲打这么多字,难怪酱油哥笑话你。
                                                    • 我就是这么笨吗,所以笨鸟先飞. 酱油哥笑话我不怕, 讥讽也可以, 但是要实实在在的指出来并举例说明, 最好做出表率, 身先士卒. 这样我会敬重他的.
                                    • 我开始留意口语里的语法,是两三年以前的事情。但直到现在,现在一说快了,语法还是会混乱。
                                      • 口语不讲语法的。
                                        • 好象不是这么说吧?口语语法可以松懈一点。但就是说出来的话,有语法和没语法,说句势力的大实话,教育程度,经济社会地位差很多。语法是一个明显的标志。
                                          • 说句势力的大实话,这话他未必听得懂。
                                            • You are so late today.
                                          • double negation: I didn’t do nothing. I didn’t do anything.
                                            absence of 3rd-person singular forms
                                            He don’t have no choice. He doesn’t have a choice.

                                            omission of the copula(to be)
                                            don’t think he married. I don’t think he is married.
                                            • 口语表达虽然不同于书面表达,但口语有口语的规矩,规矩就是“法”,你可以不去遵守,本地人绝大多数也懒得给你指正,后果是影响交流。
                                              • Well those happen to be real American / Canadian English. I heard professors speaking that way and no one else said anything except you with English being your third language. Colloquial English is different from written English.
                                                There are big differences between formal and informal English too.
                                                • 你举的那几个例子在日常口语里常常听得到,何劳你敲字。这不等于说口语没语法。两回事。口语有口语的规矩,而且随场合变。不过你爱怎么说就怎么说吧。
                                                • 我肯定你的词汇里没有"level of register"这个表达,所以听到本地人说点非正式英文就乐得以为口语可以“非正式”了,你也得懂什么叫“非正式”才行啊。
                                                  • As I said you know what you know but you won’t ever know what you don’t even understand now. But I wouldn’t say you are a very ignorant or narrow-minded person, or a person with limited sight.
                                            • 哎哟我的老兄啊,这是哪儿跟哪儿啊!Double negation 指的是 是诸如"it is not uncommon to do something" "not impossible" 这样比较间接的表达。"I ain't got nothing." 那不colloquial, 那叫完全没有语法,没受过教育,拿来开开玩笑也是可以的。
                                              • Black English. You hear it often all over the States especially in Brooklyn.
                                                • 咱不够黑,不学那样的英语,啊!
                                                  • I know and you don’t have to. I am just saying that if one has not heard something then just don’t assume it doesn’t even exist. Well my comments in particular go to Winterstorm.
                                                    • 我承认还有很多词汇和表达是我所不知道的,不过你举的那几个例子,实在是小学生的档次,你进而推出的结论更是可笑。
                                                      • Bravo. Way to go.
                                                      • This part of the forum entertains discussions about English or French perhaps. If you could do instant writing in proper English I would be convinced. Or I will remain suspicious on your credibility
                                                        • 翻旧贴去吧,英法都有。我的英文程度如何不重要,你信不信更不重要。本人只需要给我发支票的人信。
                                                          • Do I need to? No. You are a self - indulged talker not a doer due to incapability. Make a good living, eat snow crabs every day and enjoy life. Just don't forget
                                                            commenting on our writings.